Greetings and a legal thought...

[d.lea]

microwaves pass through your car, your roof even your body.here is a thought. when transmitted microwaves enter your body who do they belong to?have you ever seen a movie where a crazy lady is wearing an aluminum collander for a hat, or a tin foil helmet to keep the government and aliens from stealing their thoughts?well microwaves are naturally occuring and transmitted (microwave oven,radio signals) they bombard us 100% of the time.they can't be stopped.when they are echo shot from space directly at you and your property is that trespassing.when you turn these same signals into tv reception its that stealing.to find the answer follow the lobbyist money to washington.the world needs to make a profit. but if I am not to use these microwaves stop shooting them theough me...make any sense?dave

[robtex]

my opinion of course they are trespassing. but the moment that you execute code to dicpher the feed, bingo totally illegal. its no different than living in the apt and adding the other lines of HBO or Cinemax and then saying i dont know how that happened. Unless Di$h comes over and says here, use this free until we pick it up, then sub is required. just another thoughtless ramble.

[wrangler]

Well, I'm going to slap on my colander and pray for this thread to be closed. In other words "tell it to the judge"!

[zonerman]

Hello;

I have read this twice just to make sure I wasn't missing some great logic, I wasn't.

I hate these types of posts that take some small part of fact and extend its meaning beyond reality.

Basically one has the right to enjoyment of their property unless that enjoyment interferes with another's rights. These are founded in common law for the mutual benefit of society.

Simple logic states that you really do not control the land to the core of the earth and airspace within your property lines. You cannot build buildings as high as you want on your property, you cannot stop planes from violating your airspace, you cannot dam a water source that passes through your property to another's.

If you discover oil or mineral underground you may be forced to relinquish that property if you cannot reasonably extract that resource. All for the greater good so that others who can, will.

As for airwaves, given the omnidirectional nature of these waves upon which signals are transmitted, they basically are granted right of way access to your property. So no they they not become your property by trespassing. Actually nothing is automatically yours if it is on your property either by trespassing or not.

For Gawd Sakes, we all know what we are doing here stop with the lame justifications.

[smokymtn]

zonerman

I appreciate your enthusiasm; for the not liking the posts is your right.

But as you notice people like to express there opinun in these posts and thats ok (unless falcon deems different)

What you stated is very good, but let people enjoy venting

Have a great day

P.S

Everything is correct unless you are speaking about Government

[imtrmccoy]

If you live in a city or small parcel of land, then you are almost correct. The reason that I say this is because once upon a time that was a large parcel of land that was subdivided to its now smaller size. When this happened the person that owned it and subdivided it kept the mineral rights. I own approx 1500 acres of land (mineral right included) that 3 oil companies are paying me quite a lot of money for. One is paying me royalities for the natural gas that is under it (they are also paying all who own the adjacent properties that through sysmic testing have determined the pocket of gas is also under their property). The 2nd is paying for several drilling locations (damage permit) which they will use, but have to reclaim (return to original condition) when they are done with it,(of which I will still own). The 3rd is purchasing easment rights from me to run a pipeline, compressor stations, and powerlines. When finished (in 50 years which is how long all the contracts last) we can redo the contracts or I can take the land back, except for the part which I gave up right to under the easment laws. If I want that back I have to purchase it back. As far a water rights are concerned, if it's a river or a adjudicated irrigation water, then you are correct. But if it's a water line, and you own the land, and it wasn't there when you purchased the land then they have to get your permission to put it on your land (except if it is deemed necessary through the court of law, in which case they can have the land condemed and go through it anyway). In this case you no longer own the land and get nothing in return for it. One of the reasons for this is because someone down stream has purchased the water rights (California owns a large percentage of the water rights of the Colorado river) therfore Colorado has to let a certain percentage of the water go downstream. California purchased it from Colorado. I could go on and on, but this is just food for thought and really doesn't belong here.

[pventon]

i once told my mother she was being bombarded with porn and religion at the same time,with all kinds of porn and all kinds of religion..... shes in her late 80's , and all she said was she didnt feel any different.... no warm fuzzy feelings ..... but on the phony legal side of recieving signals that you have no choice over , what about taking the dog for a walk on the public street, or for that matter floating in the ocean or really doing it right , while you sky dive ,..... your being equally bombarded by micro waves, and what about those microwaves perhaps contributing to over heating your house, causing you to use more power to cool you off..... What you do with these waves is your business, and as long as your not making a profit by selling the signal to someone else, wheather you accept the heating , or transform the signal to heat up your mind... there is no contest... this bantering has been going on for many decades and will always be as long as one side or both feel cheated..... it all started when someone inhaled someone elses inhalables...... we are all just farting around against thunder .

[willieson1]

We all should know that any thing on the airways is open to anyone that receives it just as any thing on Internet is there for all to see it is the transmitter of the information's responsibility to keep others from viewing that information they put in the public domain, by countermeasures. But they are trying to and succeeding with moving the responsibility to the reciver of that data

[pepper rex]

Originally Posted by voop

Hi...I'm Voop,

Here are newbe greetings with a legal thought...

I admit I have watched free DishNet with hacker files I downloaded from
the internet...you probly know one such site ?
Well they used to post the signal decryption files for total DishNet service
(prior to NagraVision3 encryption...you at all familiar with that
?)...or most all of it...and we just downloaded the hacker files and
watched free DishNet.
I having studied some United States federal laws of real estate...I learned that one's property extends all around ones borders, say of a house and land...extends from the ground down to the center of the earth...and all the sky above the house extending all the way up into the sky as far as is the atmosphere...ionosphere etc....
Thus...the DishNet satellite signals which reached my roof legally belonged to me to do with as i chose...sorta like they trespassed on my property...as the air space all above the property belongs to the homeowner ....so I was not legally stealing anything...simply using the air space on my own roof which legally is mine. Thus I stole nothing...and am not a thief....nor a "pirate" as DishNet kept illegally calling me.

This should be noted by all for the record.

Lets all hope for a NagraVision 3 breakthrough as soon as possible.
And remember...nothing is unhackable....only thru time and reverse engineering technology is it done.

Enjoy and keep well,
-Voop

Great post and logical thinking. Now the next time the postman arrives on your property you can legally grab him too.

[fifties]

I haven't read through all nine pages of this thread, so forgive me if this is redundant;

It is a violation -in the United States- of the Digital Millenium Copyright Act (DMCA) to intercept encrypted programming, and this extends to include programming originated in other countries (as in from Canada's satellite TV provider).

Why is this law on the books? Well, because the US Government wanted to foster the infant DTH satellite tv industry in the nineties, they added it to the generally copyright rich language of the bill, in order to help protect them.

The law certainly is outmoded, what with over 30 million subs between Charlie and Dave, but of course it will never get removed from it's place in now codified law.

The catch for the providers is, prove, by either a preponderance of the evidence (Civil Court), or beyond a reasonable doubt (if the govenment is prosecuting a criminal complaint) that the citizen is decrypting and viewing DTH programming illegally.

Short of them videotaping you watching HBO or whatever via a tricked FTA STB, ain't gonna happen.

A recent ruling from the US Circuit Court (The specific district escapes me) in regards to a case where the RIAA was suing a person for D/L music, and were using the DMCA as a reference, was a victory for our community.

They determined that the mere possession of a device that could be used for piracy was not in and of itself grounds for a judgment in favor of the plaintiff.

IDK what device the defendant had, but this would or certainly should cover the separate pieces -in our hobby- by themselves; FTA STB's and Binary Files. In fact, ownership of a Dongle would also be included, as long as the owner wasn't ID'd as receiving CW's over the 'net.

This is a far cry from the Dave era, where they were able to convince in certain courtrooms, that possession of an (unlooper/bootloader/card programmer) was only meant for one thing, i.e., stealing their programming.